ON THE ROPES (5)
But it may well have been and I bet it was a listen
It was a terrific listen
there's got to have a but here. You can't have anarchy
There was no anarchy on that show. There was no
I had of said "This f'n ref we've gotta
that's anarchy and it's also dull and it's brutish and boorish,
it wasn't. It was a five minute section between what I thought
was beyond football, I thought this was a law and order thing
.You see if they were satisfied with
the way it was going
. I mean you were an enormously
They weren't satisfied! They weren't. I had been called in
before that, three or four, very pleasantly, I mean there's
no "Sit down Baker
" There's none of that because
I wouldn't tolerate that and neither would they I'm sure.
I'd been called in three times saying, you know, it was the
time when Sky was buying up football. The Beeb were losing
things all over the place. They didn't want me ah
people to ring in. If you've heard a shocking terrible rumour
about a footballer, ring us up and we will pick the legal
bones out of it, call him Mr X and we will say what they done.
Now I'm not going to turn that radio off, that's fantastic!
You know, it was just very pixyish, but the Beeb all of a
sudden thought. Listen, we're going to lunch with them and
they're not going to let Five Live have, they're not going
to let us into Elland Road again; and I'm not paranoid, but
as it came about a few weeks later, " Ah well, better
get rid of him". It could have been anything, by that
time we were on borrowed time, I was living on borrowed time
So in other words what you are saying is that the BBC regarded
you as a trouble maker..
.......potentially damaging their own interests
Yes I think I was
with the football establishment?
When I was fired, they wanted me to come back and do the
Saturday show, they didn't get rid of me, they said
the Saturday Show was silly and I did it with Danny Kelly
and it was
..the better show in fact. It was very
funny and they wanted to put
..They asked me to come
back. They said - can you imagine - they've just fired you,
they said, "But we'd like you to do the Saturday Show";
and that was that. I said, "No, I think we know were
.." it was very civilised. I think we
know were we're both going with this don't we? I cannot be
the cockney on the string saying, "Well what about referees,
no names please? These are decent people paying hard-earned
money, taking days off work and because there's so much hand
in glove in this national game, you can't be fair about it
and shouldn't ask to be. But we can do is get a great radio
show out of it. It wasn't irresponsible, nothing I don't believe
on that was irresponsible at all
But it wasn't only the BBC who thought you were irresponsible.
The media generally thought you were irresponsible
The Newspapers thought you were irresponsible
Yeah, but even so, I don't. Yeah, but when you meet the Hacks
one-by-one they miss it a lot. I do think, it was
it hasn't been replaced. I would think in football, we can
talk about Pets Win Prizes and argue about that if you like,
but in football phone-in/broadcasting, I am the best. I am
the best at it and that's it. It's like saying, what's the
fastest plane? Concorde. Who's the best football phone-in?
I am and I don't care how much that jars, I am. I've never
been replaced over there and you know ..that's the truth.
Tell me this. If you're the best, why aren't you doing it
Because nobody will employ me, no one will have it. I was
But I mean, nobody includes Talk Radio.
Yeah, but you know, Kelvin McKenzie took over Talk Radio
and the first thing Kelvin does is, his phrase says, to the
bone, to the bone. I was getting £1,200 a show. Kelvin
McKenzie takes over, looks at the balance sheet; I don't think
that takes a genius to work
and again, it's not
saying, why did he do that? That makes sense to me. In other
areas I can be insecure, not in the football broadcasting.
I know exactly what I'm doing there and the audience follows
us you know, it just is.
All right. Let's look at some of the other areas, some of
the television programmes that you did..
Oh no, here we go.
Which you're clearly not going to defend? ·
There's nothing to defend, they're television shows. You
know, one out of what, three hundred TV shows work? I can
give you two or three that work you can give me four or five
that didn't. All that you can do when you go into any series
is say, it's got half a chance. If I was more, If I was in
anyway, if I had some kind of work ethic that made me turn
up and want shows to succeed and put time into them. But the
thing is, I'm a great, hopefully I'm a pretty good guest,
I can always give stuff. But in telly speak, that'll always,
give him his own chat show. That's happened stacks of times.
I mean the talk show is the cushion over the face you know;
do that kind of radio again, that's great! To me that's great
to the above
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